Letter from a Confused African-American Woman: Feeling Guilty for Wanting to Move On from Black Men

This is a email that was forwarded to me by a follower of my blog:

“I am just so confused about everything right now. I do not know where to start.

I’ve always preferred Black men because of our history and culture and I am physically attracted to them.  I also love dancing with Black men, we have a natural rhythm when we are together.However, I also can look at a white man (and many other races of man) and find him handsome. Even though, I am attracted to all races of men, I always thought that Black men and Black women had a special bond because of our culture and the way we’ve been treated globally. you would think we would be our own support system, but it doesn’t seem so any more.

When i got older, i began to notice that a cultural rift between black women and black men was developing. I noticed that as proud as I was of my culture and as tied to my roots and history as I was, so many young Black men, especially, just did not seem to care.

I had black male acquaintances, relatives and family friends who wouldn’t even date Black women or if they did date bw, it was never serious and they delayed marriage for years, so much so, that black women weren’t marrying at all. But, i noticed when these same Black men were with non-bw, the question got popped usually much faster, like within a year max. My black woman cousin and my friend were both hurt this christmas because they thought their long time boyfriends (who were black) would propose to them. One has been dating and loving the guy for four years and she was heart-broken that she didn’t get a ring this xmas. I worry that the guy may never propose to her because some black men think it’s okay to string bw along and they don’t take us seriously in terms of marriage.

I notice all these things, but I kept quiet about them because I didn’t want to judge all Black men based off of this. I still don’t. But, the turning point finally came when I went on YouTube, innocently researching for a college paper , and came across a YouTube video by a Black man who was verbally abusing, berating and demeaning ALL Black women. I was sickened by what I heard. I never in my life would have expected to hear some of the hurtful things being said about Black women… from a Black man. I later discovered that there were literally hundreds of videos like this about black women
(95% by bm) on youtube and i was crushed. My self-esteem was just wounded so much by this. Couple that with the actions of the black men i mentioned earlier and you can only imagine how that made me feel. Even the white guys who I went to school and college with(some of whom were very conservative and close-minded) did not stoop to the levels of these Black men on YouTube. I would expect racist behavior from a close-minded, conservative white male, but I always thought that Black men, of all people, would know how it feels to be mistreated based on skin color.

so, for the first time, i wondered if maybe i was holding onto the past in terms of my expectations for marriage with a black man. i thought about my father and grandfathers, who were and are all wonderful black men and above all, beautiful human beings who cared for their families. I wanted to build a legacy like that with a Black man too. I was proud of my culture and still am, but when I see some of the things I am seeing, it makes me feel like I am living in the past with my hope for finding a Black husband and building a black culture. Most Black men may not be “marrying interracially” on paper, but most black men also aren’t marrying at all. I feel like some black men love to string black women along, but when they get with a non-bw, then they want to take her seriously and pop the question. It’s too much emotionally for me. I’ve never been a so-called “strong black woman,” I am vulnerable and was raised to cry when I’m hurt and ask when I need help.
I find some white men to be handsome, I enjoy their lighter colored eyes, (although i still love brown) but because of our history and cultural differences, I have always been turned off by them in a romantic sense. It seems there is just a gulf between white men/black women when it comes to their understanding of the black experience and that is because their white privilege blinds them. However, after some of the hurtful words and experiences with Black men, honestly I feel like if i’m going to be mistreated like that from black men any way, i might as well just go with a non-black man. I also worry that if I continue going down this path with Black men, i may very well end up alone and never get the family life that I’ve always wanted and grew up with.

But, it is not fair to default to white men because of some negative experiences with Black men and because the black culture is deteriorating. I wouldn’t want to do that to any man, including a white man, but emotionally I cannot HELP, but crave that protection and validation from white men because i am so emotionally wounded by the hurtful words and treatment by certain black men. I never felt this way before encountering the mistreatment that I did.

Intellectually, I tell myself that it is wrong to seek that validation and that I need to judge people as individuals, but emotionally, I want that validation. Part of me knows that if I am with a white man, then i am going to get a certain degree of protection and i would feel beautiful and valued because he chose me. But the logical part of my brain is telling me this is the wrong way to think and that i am cheating, not only the man who i become involved with, but myself by going into a relationship with that mentality.

I want to be with a man because i love him as a person, not because i think his skin color will bring me validation or protection. I despise that mentality, yet emotionally, i crave the protection and value from white men that, some black men, it seems, are unwilling or unable to offer.

it is ironic because i never felt comfortable around white men when i was younger, but now after hearing some of the hateful things from black men, i feel so unprotected, so despised and so unwanted that i don’t even care if a white man doesn’t understand the black experience any more, i just want to be safe and cared for. even if a white man doesn’t understand everything that i go through as a black person, at least he could give me the protection and care that i crave. i hate that i feel this way.

but at the same time, part of me is saddened because I know that institutional racism & white privilege are a large part of the reason that Black men haven’t been able to give Black women the support that we need and I feel like I am abandoning them and going to the group of men who have benefitted the most from the very system that has destroyed us, as a people. While, I completely see and empathize with Black men because institutional racism is an issue, I cannot fathom why some Black men would be so cruel to Black women and take their anger out on us. There is no excuse for that and it hurts terribly, but what can I do?

I also feel guilty because, if i become involved with a white man, I don’t want to just default to him for that protection and validation, that is not fair to him. He is an individual too, he is a human being and I want to connect with him as a human being, love him, care for him, support him and give him what he needs.

Of course, white men are far from perfect and yes, some can be ignorant about Black people, but emotionally, i cannot stop wanting that feeling of being protected and safe and i know a white man can more readily provide that, ironically, because of the very privilege that has historically disenfranchised black people as a collective.

Needless to say, I am very confused and don’t know what to do. “

39 thoughts on “Letter from a Confused African-American Woman: Feeling Guilty for Wanting to Move On from Black Men

  1. wow, she says she is interested in other men but all I read was white men, what about latino, Asian, heck even men from other countries. It seems whenever people want to date out they jump to white as the default.
    As for the marriage thing well if some black males don’t want marriage don’t mess with them don’t do everything for them either. too many women put out, cook, clean, and live with the guy so there is nothing for him to work for.
    People of this generation are very different from previous ones men and women have changed and not for the better. I see women that can’t cook and men that can’t even change a tire.
    The black men that bash black women fit a certain pattern, they are usually from single parent households or are mommas boys, have self hate, and the funny thing is a lot of them have kids with black women. They bash because the women in their life are “ratchet” and so because they have not figured out that they are the problem since they keep choosing said ratchet females they blame all black women.
    Black women bashed black men on tv talk shows back in the day, black women of this generation had nothing to do with that but like with everything else what mess others leave behind is the mess the next generations have to deal with. Now some black males are bashing black women, either way I think both ain’t sh3it and are part of the problem. stop broadcasting our issues to the world and putting each other on blast otherwise when more black men and black women get blasted by a gun nobody will care. because they will say see black on black crime and black men and black women bashing each other so why should anybody care if they are killed heck they don’t even care about each other.

    • I agree 100%, but still what is a young lady to do when she is confronted with lack of marital opportunities within her own ethnicity? I think sometimes women go to white men as the default because they are the majority group and more likely to come in contact with them than say a Chinese man and not every woman has the means to fly to Africa to find a Black man from another ethnicity. that is the problem.

      I agree 100%, Black people need to stop airing our diryt laundry. I don’t know that I agree that Black women “bashed,” Black men back in the day. It was not at the level that Black men have been doing. When I was young, all I can remember is occasionally a Black woman complaining in a movie about how it’s hard to find a black man because of jail, homosexuality etc…that shouldn’t have been aired, but never did I hear a black woman saying black men were inherently inferior as some black men of today do.

      • If the woman or man can’t find someone in their own race that is willing to do those things all i can say is keep ur standards don’t lower them for others. i’ve seen some people say they want a healthy person, with a degree, a good personality,etc but when they date out they lower their standards. If the person doesn’t lower their reasonable standards and finds someone else that is fine. But it is not fine to bash somebody else or to go around saying this person is better. if someone is happy with somebody else that is good everybody deserves someone that treats them right. And heck if someone has dependable friends or family they can set them up with someone. my parents met through a friend and they’ve been together for almost 23 yrs.
        I wouldn’t mind if my mom chose a man for me lol, she knows what i like and what i need bhawhwhaa.

    • i think it’s because if you’re going to “date out” then white is usually the closest thing culturally speaking to black, due to our shared history. we have far more in common with white people, on average, than we do with hispanics, asians, indians, etc. and the latter two groups are almost totally unwilling to date black women/men at all. generally speaking, that is. on average, white men are more open to it, and while hispanic men have been known to be attracted to black women, most are more reluctant to pursue serious relationships with us.

    • It is a shame the way some black women behave in public or at home in front of their children. I agree with you. From my understanding of her “article”, I don’t think she bashes the other ethnicities because she did not mention them.

      • u getting personal now lol. I feel fine because i’m not interested in dating now . I like my space and i don’t like people eating up my stuff and using my stuff without asking. in the future if i want to be in a relationship i know i have a better chance of meeting somebody in a predominately black area, my family goes to louisiana alot and there are alot of black males there so i’m not too worried. It is weird being in texas and seeing a bit of swirling and then going to louisisana into a black neighborhood and not seeing that but then again louisiana is pretty segregated the only white looking people i see in the neighborhood are creole. My cousins on my moms side are all dating or married to black women. my uncle is getting married in july and my cousin is getting married next month.

  2. “but I always thought that Black men, of all people, would know how it feels to be mistreated based on skin color.”
    Yes well it is another example of when the oppressed try to become like the oppressor. some black men can only see their own pain.

    “I cannot HELP, but crave that protection and validation from white men because i am so emotionally wounded by the hurtful words and treatment by certain black men”
    I hope she means she wants protection and validation from a man not just a white man as any man of any race can provide that.

    “Part of me knows that if I am with a white man, then i am going to get a certain degree of protection and i would feel beautiful and valued because he chose me”

    U should feel beautiful and valued whether a man chooses u or not, a white man or any man for that matter won’t make u feel valued if don’t feel valued by yourself, no man can make u happy u have to start out being happy and they will either add or take away from that. No woman’s value goes up simply because she has a man.

    “I want to be with a man because i love him as a person, not because i think his skin color will bring me validation or protection. I despise that mentality, yet emotionally, i crave the protection and value from white men that, some black men, it seems, are unwilling or unable to offer.”

    And that is how the whole white is better propaganda works, u see white men being the princes, the knight in shining armor, and being heroes and u think well they will save me they will protect me. how can black men provide that validation if they are not white? U said u think a white man will bring validation and protection and the reason for that is because of white privilege ,black men don’t have that. white privilege we see brings protection to the people with the complexion for protection so now we see black people and poc that think now if i could get close enough to them some of that privilege and protection will rub off on me.

    “I cannot fathom why some Black men would be so cruel to Black women and take their anger out on us. There is no excuse for that and it hurts terribly, but what can I do?”

    black people has a whole have been conditioned to attack each other and fear whites and don’t challenge white supremacy as that could lead to death. Parents tell their kids don’t u rock the boat don’t u challenge anybody and that is why we are paying for it now. Did u know the gangs in cali were first started to protect the black neighborhoods from angry whites? now look at them they are killing each other over respect, drugs, and territory. People have become more bi@ch arse with each generation and not wanting to step up and blow the whistle. They take their anger out on black women because they are scared, they know if they attack white supremacy they will be severely punished but if they attack their own there will be less consequences. it is the reason why when there is poverty domestic violence is up why? because not being able to measure up affects people, not being able to be up to the standard makes people feel inadequate and angry so they take it out on the people that depend on them and point out the differences.

    • yes, i knew some gangs like the CRIPs (community representation in progress?) and the reformed vice lords were trying to improve their local communities, but then got corrupted.

      “They take their anger out on black women because they are scared, they know if they attack white supremacy they will be severely punished but if they attack their own there will be less consequences.”

      that may be the reason they do it, but what can black women do about that? black women have to live their lives too

      • I don’t think black women can do anything about it except leave those kind of men alone and if they do encounter them don’t stay around them. I see it seems the black community is headed to where the native americans are. native American women have the highest domestic and sexual violence against them. Until black men and women see ourselves as equals to each other and look out for each other that is where we are headed. Too many have learned the bad ways of others, some black males can just call out black women for trying to be like other women but they can’t see they are also trying to be like other men.
        Black women do have lives we have to live imo whether black men or women have beef with each other the kids are the most important. If it comes to a point where black men and black women don’t care about black children then it is a major issue. right now it is like some black men and black women are bitter divorced people attacking each other, it is only a matter of time before they bring kids into it and start not caring about the children but caring about how to spite each other and using kids as pawns. I see it already with a handful not caring about trayvon or renisha McBride.
        Black women have to take care of ourselves first, if some black males and females can’t hack it they will be left behind. we should be loyal to ourselves, children, family and friends that are loyal to us. I would not ask black people to be loyal to other black people just by skin color alone, it has to be more to them than that, as we have plenty of black skinned white supremacists in our community. I would not ask black women to be loyal to the sotomayors of our race.
        The main argument I see black men and women having is about the no good black men and women. Some sisters and brothers will say u black men or u black women do not call out these wrong black men or wrong black women. or they blame each other for what is going on. Until the real black men and women step up and get the bad ones out we will continue on this destructive path. Parents have to do better much better because most of this mess starts with family.

  3. Hello Peanut, Happy New Year. My thoughts on this post

    1)”But, the turning point finally came when I went on YouTube, innocently researching for a college paper , and came across a YouTube video by a Black man who was verbally abusing, berating and demeaning ALL Black women. I was sickened by what I heard. I never in my life would have expected to hear some of the hurtful things being said about Black women… from a Black man. I later discovered that there were literally hundreds of videos like this about black women(95% by bm) on youtube and i was crushed. My self-esteem was just wounded so much by this.”
    As a black man, I have tried my hardest to respect my fellow black women as they have many demons to deal with in society( racism & sexism from white men, racism from white women and sadly, sometimes sexism from their own black men). Obviously being human and myself being impacted by the notions of white supremacy, I have sometimes not been 100% perfect but I do understand that if the quality of life is going to improve in Black America, black men have to treat and support black women better(especially when you consider that African American family parenting is usually maternal). Damaged black women=damaged black children= poor education, drugs & crime, poor health, does not know purpose on this Earth, going to the grave early. It is really sad that these minority of black men usually have the loudest platforms.

    2)”My black woman cousin and my friend were both hurt this christmas because they thought their long time boyfriends (who were black) would propose to them. One has been dating and loving the guy for four years and she was heart-broken that she didn’t get a ring this xmas. I worry that the guy may never propose to her because some black men think it’s okay to string bw along and they don’t take us seriously in terms of marriage.”
    I know for women when they get that proposal of marriage, it is indeed an exciting thing to experience. However, in the black community, marriage is usually not on the radar and out of wedlock births are high in Black America. While the out of wedlock rates have probably risen over the years, this is not a new thing in the black community. From my research even as far back as the 1920s, black women have always had a higher out of wedlock rate compared to women from other racial groups. This observation was even mentioned in the Monihyan report back in the 1950s or 1960s about Negro women having babies out of marriage. In fact, welfare and other government aid programs(e.g. food stamps,etc.) has often been given a negative eye due to many peoples’ belief that it is for black women to just pop out babies. While there are indeed many black people in healthy and happy marriages, maybe black folks and marriage is not an important cultural thing to look forward to. Besides the crux of the focus should be whether black men in long term relationships with black women(even if they dont put a ring on it, just like a common-law marriage) are good partners and will be good fathers to their future children because in truth, marriage is basically a piece of paper, it does not always equal a happy union.

    3)”i hate that i feel this way.but at the same time, part of me is saddened because I know that institutional racism & white privilege are a large part of the reason that Black men haven’t been able to give Black women the support that we need and I feel like I am abandoning them and going to the group of men who have benefitted the most from the very system that has destroyed us, as a people.Of course, white men are far from perfect and yes, some can be ignorant about Black people, but emotionally, i cannot stop wanting that feeling of being protected and safe and i know a white man can more readily provide that, ironically, because of the very privilege that has historically disenfranchised black people as a collective.Needless to say, I am very confused and don’t know what to do. “

    This is where black people in interracial relationships just becomes weird as there needs to be a division between your individual love life and a collective societal problem that affects African-Americans. As I have said before, every single person has a right to be happy and in a loving healthy relationship with a chance for reproduction(making children). As a black man, if I find a white woman or if your blog follower or any other black woman finds a white man for love, LET IT BE. I dont believe that anyone should feel “guilty” about their romantic/sexual behaviors and I dont feel that anyone, black or white, should tell you who to be with. However, on the flip side of coin, I dont believe that any black man or black woman who is dating or married to a white person should be concerning themselves or speaking about problems that affects black people.WHY? Because 9 times out of 10, you are going to be a wolf in sheep’s clothing anyway and no self-respecting black person would align themselves with your agenda. You will try to profit off white supremacy(whether it is financial, social or to have “lighter skin babies” for them to have a better chance in life) THEN all of sudden, you will try to have some moral outrage about white supremacy. And when there is a fight to battle white supremacy, the first words out of your mouth will be-”Im colorblind or the not all whites argument”. When I had some minor interracial unions with white women when I was younger here in my hometown of New York City, I did not speak about what was going on in Harlem or Bedford-Stuyvesant because I would look like I completely lost my mind! I will put my 100% trust in racist police force(e.g. Frank Rizzo’s 1970s Philadelphia Police) than in any black person who is with a white person. A black man with a white woman or a black woman with a white man is my partner in fighting white supremacy?REALLY?As the late writer George Orwell said “Some ideas are so stupid that only intellectuals believe them.”
    -My advice for this confused black sista, if she does eventually have a romantic union with a white man, is to live your life, have a great and healthy relationship, and dont worry about “abandoning black men”. Those other Negroes will be okay and get their problems solved by Farrakhan or some other black radical.

    Hope you enjoyed my comments Peanut. I speak harsh but sometimes truth is harsh! Anyway, I love your blog postings and all the best in 2014.

    • new to this conversation, but i just want to say that mstoogood4yall is hands-down, the best commentator I have EVER seen online regarding black women and dealing with black men. your comments are AWESOME na truly life-affirming. thank you!

  4. I think black women have a right to explore their options. If they aren’t finding love within the black community then, they aren’t obligated to stick it out with black men for the sake of adding to the army.

    Black women are tired imo. The blind loyalty, the constant bashing and trying to measure up in order to please black men, it’s getting played and tiresome. A lot of black women just want to be loved and treated with some respect. Black women are the only group told to stick it out and put up with abuse for the sake of black love, unfortunately by other black women.

    It’s even transferred through celebrity black women, look at the Ciara/Future, Gabrielle Union/D.Wade, Ludacris/Euxodie drama. It’s sad. Black women we can be our own worst enemy.
    She shouldn’t feel guilty about anything, she doesn’t owe anyone a reason as into why she wants to date inter-racially, but since she does have many reasons she’s entitled to them without people bullying her about it. Black women’s bodies and lives shouldn’t be dictated by anyone.
    I see black women marrying and dating white men and non-black men on blogs 24/7 and they seem pretty content and happy.

    And I wish people will stop making excuses for the way black men act and treat black women. We don’t make excuses for black women, we call sistas with that mentality self haters, ratchet, and other derogatory names. That’s another reason black women probably feel the need to seek elsewhere is the lack of emotional support issued in the black community from black men or black women.

    All black men care about is catering to their misogynistic, sexist, woes.
    And all black women care about it is keeping black babies being born. I’m annoyed, probably why I’m so disconnected from my own community. It’s mental abuse asylum for black women.

    • “She shouldn’t feel guilty about anything, she doesn’t owe anyone a reason as into why she wants to date inter-racially, but since she does have many reasons she’s entitled to them without people bullying her about it. Black women’s bodies and lives shouldn’t be dictated by anyone.”

      I agree with 100% Ebonychic205. While I would never listen to or trust any black person(black man or black woman) who is dating/married to a white person and then claims to be against white supremacy or speaks about social issues because I know they are not really serious and do enjoy the profit margins that white privilege via their partner gives them, you are right that people have a right to their individual romantic/sexual desires without others poking into their business. Its live and let live. As I said in my posting-”I dont believe that anyone should feel “guilty” about their romantic/sexual behaviors and I dont feel that anyone, black or white, should tell you who to be with.

      Anyway, I agree with your post.

  5. now for some solutions:

    1. don’t be around destructive people, let them self destruct by themselves

    2. stop blaming each other for ur own issues or ur own choices, black women nor black men are to blame for ur last failed relationship, u are the common factor in it.

    3. love yourself, don’t let anybody decide your worth that is not for them to decide the creator made u therefore the creator knows ur worth more than anybody on this earth

    4. build strong quality families, quality is more important than quantity

    5. work on ur anti blackness and self hate, we all deal with it from time to time

    6. before u look down on somebody or bash them think about ur own wrongs and ur family members that are not 100% right but u love and care about anyways, as that is somebody else that is a work in progress

    7. don’t excuse piss poor behavior from urself or people around u, but don’t put them on blast either, go to that person and tell them what they did wrong if they don’t listen don’t deal with them anymore

    8. black men realize that black women are ur past, present and future, if u fail to protect black women it is a wrap for u

    8. black women realize black men are u past, present, and future, if u fail to choose right it is a wrap for u

    9. black men and women need to stop calling each other out, let black men call out the bad behavior of other black men, and let black women call out the bad behavior of other black women, because sometimes things get heated because of miscommunication men and women communicate differently a lot of times.

    10. know that racism is not exclusive to just u, men and women deal with it, and don’t blame another black person for u not getting something over them, get rid of ur crabs in the barrel mentality. That black person did not take ur job the people hiring gave it to them.

    11. realize words are powerful so use them wisely

  6. as for the black males that get on youtube and bash black women, we need to study them as there is a lesson in almost everything. Notice a lot of them have kids with black women, they know on some level they need to have black kids so they have them then they start bashing black women as they’ve gotten what they wanted.
    Black men and women need to realize that black women are important if we decide not to have kids the population goes down. And non black people are not snatching black men and women up at high numbers because of everything from stereotypes to family. we mostly date, procreate, and marry each other.

    The black males that don’t realize these things either are lost and delusional or just hate blackness so much they want it erased. A lot of this stuff is about genetic survival, all males of every species fear being wiped out. white males fear it that is why they created laws keeping other men from their women all the while spreading their seed to other women. Black males know they don’t have the same broad appeal white men do because white males have been able to use the media to campaign themselves as being the best men.

    white males have better choices of women from white, Asian, and latina. Black men have the one women that white men have not really been able to woo and that is black women. If more black women decide not to be with black men it is a wrap for them because they are not seen in the same light as white men, they are not given the same benefit of the doubt as white men. if black women decided to turn their backs on them they are screwed whether they realize it or not. they can be delusional and think other women have their back but to be honest those other women have bought into the lies and propaganda of the media more than anybody. They fantasize about white men taking them, why do u think the Asian fetish stuff has been able to go on, because of the propaganda they have taken as truth. Then there are some latinos that won’t even acknowledge their black ancestry and just look at the gangs and prisons who are fighting each other most?

    Lastly stop contradicting urself, u can’t be bagging on biracial men then turning around and creating the same biracial males that u say u can’t stand. Don’t complain about Obama and halle berry being sell outs as that is what u created.

  7. mstoogood4yall, hope all is well with you in 2014. You preach truth my dear!

    1)”And non black people are not snatching black men and women up at high numbers because of everything from stereotypes to family. we mostly date, procreate, and marry each other.”
    -The way black people talk about interracial dating would make you think that it is a huge event. Yet the data and reality does not confirm it! Its like a doctor focusing on a common cold as opposed to diabetes. Something so little/rare gets major attention.
    2)”The black males that don’t realize these things either are lost and delusional or just hate blackness so much they want it erased. A lot of this stuff is about genetic survival, all males of every species fear being wiped out. white males fear it that is why they created laws keeping other men from their women all the while spreading their seed to other women. Black males know they don’t have the same broad appeal white men do because white males have been able to use the media to campaign themselves as being the best men.”
    -Speak that truth!
    3)”Lastly stop contradicting urself, u can’t be bagging on biracial men then turning around and creating the same biracial males that u say u can’t stand. Don’t complain about Obama and halle berry being sell outs as that is what u created.”
    -This is just funny!

  8. The Black males on You Tube are shooting themselves in the foot by bashing Black women and girls. Black women are slowly starting to turn their backs on Black males. This is a survival tactic. Women psychologically need to feel safe and protected not hated and despised. Right now non-black men are looking less dangerous to a race of women that have experienced to much trauma over the past 30 years (crack cocaine holocaust). The videos these guys put up always focus on Black women’s looks. They intentionally seek out wounds to pour salt in. Watching too many of those videos is bad for the psyche. These guys are trying to rip Black women psychologically apart at the seems. The videos are VERY emotionally and psychologically abusive. They are going to drive Black women away by making us feel hated, unloved and denigrated. Her desire for validation is not internalized self hatred. Women are socialized to seek validation outside of ourselves. She should not feel ashamed of wanting to be loved and validated. If she is a darker skinned Black woman validation from Black males is like rain in a desert; good luck finding it. Those rabid dudes on You Tube are mentacidal.

    @mstoogood4yall
    Black males like to claim that Black women went on TV and bashed them in the 1990s. They pretend to forget the timeline. That happened during the crack cocaine holocaust. Black women were desperate for Black males to stop selling death and poison to their own people and end the gang violence. Black women saw their relatives turned into crack addicts and had to put burglar bars on every window and door. When a race of women are blindly loyal as Black women start to say, “Black men ain’t shit”, it should have been recognized as a plea to stop the crack selling, crack smoking, raping, murder, and gang violence. Black males now pretend to have amnesia and act like they didn’t sell death to their own people. Crack was a game changer and the real cause of the destruction of Black families not welfare. Crack had Black neighborhoods looking like the landscape for a Mad Max movie.

  9. Hey Alchemist, I liked your post and I agree with everything you said,especially
    “When a race of women are blindly loyal as Black women start to say, “Black men ain’t shit”, it should have been recognized as a plea to stop the crack selling, crack smoking, raping, murder, and gang violence.”
    I agree 100%.
    However, this statement I disagree with-”Crack was a game changer and the real cause of the destruction of Black families not welfare”
    While it is correct that the drug invasion of the late 1970′s,1980s and early 1990s did harm Black America in a severe way, it is important to note that substance abuse has always been a major problem in Black America anyway, especially in urban districts. Even as far back as the 1910′s when African Americans did the Great Migration to come to northern cities like New York, Chicago, Philadelphia, Boston and such, blacks had issues with drugs coming into their neighborhood(e.g. from the Mafia, etc.) and alcohol(after all,like a Baptist church, there is one in every black area!). While alcohol might take a longer time to do damage to the individual human body than crack, alcohol nevertheless damages families and communinites as alcoholics slowly lose their productive value. With that said, black people were long harmed by substance abuse before crack yet for the most part, in the pre-Civil Rights era, black families were able to maintain their stability. Also, as I mentioned about the Monhiyan report from the 1950s or 1960s, black women have always had higher out of wedlock births. Even in the 1920s/1930s, black women had children outside of marriage(maybe black folks just dont culturally value marriages!) at a higher rate than white women. However, after the Civil Rights Movement, the white liberals(more dangerous than racist white conservatives) decided they wanted to”save the Negroes” with welfare. Since welfare made it more attractive for women to have kids without the father, this was the road that many in the black community took. Basically Alchemist, I believe that the destruction of the black family(which was way before crack yet crack did indeed cause faster damage) is a combination of all these factors, not simply one drug!
    I look forward to your rebuttal but other than that, I agree with what you said.

    • Much of the early ethnographic research that made the claim that Black families were a hot mess were done using unemployed and homeless Black people and compared them to middle class white families. They didn’t use black families where dad made Buicks and had steady work. The results of this sort of slight of had is the evil Moynihan Report. Unfortunately too many Black males are emotionally invested in the Moynihan Report’s findings. It allows them to attack Black women for the destruction of Black families.
      In the Deep South, where grew up, the use of illegal drugs was rare. Crack came along and chaos followed. Northern big cities do not represent the totality of Black life. Crack made its way to small towns and cities throughout the country. Before crack all previous illegal drug scourges pretty much skipped past Black women. Crack was the first time we saw Black women becoming addicted in large numbers. The addiction of mothers and fathers led to the placement of children with grandparents or in foster homes. Black people have not really looked back and examined the impact of the crack cocaine holocaust on us.
      http://abagond.wordpress.com/2012/05/25/the-white-ethnographic-gaze-the-1960s/

      • the moynihan report has been discredited there is plenty of scholarly evidence. i’ve got a whole book about it. i am gonna dig around for it and then post some excerpts.

    • @TTNYCRN: Totally agree! And even earlier than the crack epidemic was the onslaught of gangsta rap, which started in the 80s, and it was Black MEN who bashed Black women (and even bashed Black men too) through rap music. There were rap songs about killing pregnant women and kicking them in the stomach, breaking and entering homes to rape women and girls, shooting and killing “n*ggas”, “snatchin’” peoples lives, even if it was a second life through reincarnation (hah! here’s looking at you, Dr. Dre) and all kinds of other violent ridiculousness. Even Don Cornelius of Soul Train went to Congress to stand up against and tried to put a stop to gangsta rap. Look it up.

      Black men can play the convenient amnesiac if they want and claim that Black women went on talk shows in the 90s against them, but that’s far from true, plus, Black men bashed Black women long before any talk show appearances. In fact, until Black men come to terms with the FACT that they, and they alone, are responsible for the bulk of murders and misogyny in the Black community, then we as a people are doomed anyway.

      The reason that Black male Hip Hop artists have “gained favor” among whites in recent years is because the white decision-makers always choose the most destructive social phenomena in Black culture to promote. Many BLack people hated gangsta rap, but white industry owners and their Black overseers promoted it to America and the world and normalized it, as if it was Black culture. They knew the destructive power of the hip hop mentality to the Black community, which is why they raised it up. And it worked – colorism, intra-racial racism, misogyny, violence were par-for-the-course in gangsta rap, and has now become standard thinking across the majority of Black American males. And thus, since this destructive thinking is standard to Black men now, of course they will hate Black women, and of course whites (in the power structure, not your average Joe’s) are now placing them on a pedestal. It’s the perfect way to try to end the Black community and Black Americans as race. And it’s working. Period.

  10. Really good article called “Black Feminism and Intersectionality” by Sharon Smith. It covers racism in the feminist movement; sexism in the Black nationalism movement; Black matriarchy myth; how white feminist promoted the Black male rapist myth; the serialization of Native American, Latino and Black women; Margaret Sanger and the eugenists; etc. The article has a Marxist slant.

    http://isreview.org/issue/91/black-feminism-and-intersectionality

  11. One thing, either Alchemist or Peanut could answer if you have links or any information. Alchemist said that welfare was not really responsible for the breakup of black families. I would like to get a better understanding of that fact. While there were black women who obviously were on welfare due to the poor economic standing of most Black Americans, most blacks(even during the extremes of white racism before the Civil Rights Movement) were a two income household-poor but indeed a stable two family unit. After the Civil Rights Movement, when the “good” white people wanted to help, welfare rolls expanded in Black America. So I just want to know how welfare also did not break up black families.

    • @TTNYCRN
      “When and Where I Enter: The Impact of Black Women on Race and Sex in America” by Paula Giddings, Chapter 18 “Strong Women and Strutting Men The Moynihan Report”.

      • Please Black women, understand that – although professionally written – the Moynihan report is EXTREMELY racist and places the blame for the destruction of Black communities squarely on Black women because we supposedly ran Black menoutof our communities by being aggressive or too strong. Anyone Black (or otherwise) telling you to use this as fact is racist themselves )here’s looking at you Alchemist).

        Please do not be brainwashed – the Moynihan report will truly have you gaslit, believing that you were at fault, when you are not. It is anti-Black woman completely.

  12. You say not even the most conservative wm would never stoop to such lows in bashing BW.

    That’s a lie.

    The conservative wm will never have to stoop to such lows if he has “black lap dogs” doing the work for them.

    People need to focus on their relationship, their connection to each other. Some folks dwell on this question to the point the relationship & connection becomes secondary. The bond should be primary letting marriage compliment or celebrate said union.

    The attraction & the tensile strength of any bond will be there & remain regardless if the question is popped or not. Not dismissing marriage. It’s just I see in real time some of the unhappiest people are married. These are also folks who obeyed society’s wants about age and being single is bad, when will you have kids, what will my family think & the opinions of friends instead of listening to themselves.

    Marriage is and can be wonderful thing.

    Don’t give up on BM. If I based my trust & love for the BW on YouTube, LNHH or RHOA, us being cordial to one another would be non existent.

    My love for the effervescence & resilience of the BW has never been altered & I’m bombarded w/false advertisements to convince me otherwise everyday.

    Don’t give up on us. Let’s not give up on each other.

    • “The conservative wm will never have to stoop to such lows if he has “black lap dogs” doing the work for them.”

      That is true, that is why I don’t like most of the black people in Hollywood as they are bought and paid for. There are only a few black people that are in the media that are not sell outs but even they get hushed a lot. Even some of the ones on websites that sometimes are on point will slip and try to divert attention away from racism/white supremacy. at some point the real black people need to stand up as right now it is the ignorant ones that are talking the loudest but not saying anything. when people don’t put these ignorant people in their place by correcting them then they think they are right and go unchallenged. more black men need to make vids or even pen an open letter to at least show their support and that they don’t agree with what the ignorant black males and society are saying about black women and the black community.

      But lately I’ve been seeing some vids and news articles trying to say blacks are racist from the what would u do episode where the black woman was attacking an interracial couple to oprah’s interview with the mowry twins. They are just trying to say blacks are as racist as whites when that is complete bull.

      • “more black men need to make vids or even pen an open letter to at least show their support and that they don’t agree with what the ignorant black males and society are saying about black women and the black community. ”

        And thus lies the problem. Black men are not doing that and are staying silent, so in my opinion, that means they agree – or at least are benefiting from the current situation too much to protest against the abuse of Black women. Therefore, that means that Black men are acting no differently than whites who maybe didn’t protest and bash Dr. King across the head, but they nevertheless stayed quiet about the treatment of Blacks.

        In the words of Dr. King,”in the end, we will remember not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our friends.”

        Black male silence is deafening in the black community.

    • My bad, Alchemist, I missed your other comments! I agree with your comments wholeheartedly about the evil Moynihan report. Thnaks for mentioning that.

  13. Hi,
    Just wanted to say there are plenty of healthy (not just in the body ;)), respectful, kind, loving white men who have a special interest in black women, just because they are built that way. Black women are what they are attracted to most, they do their best to understand the cultural differences and embrace them. This goes beyond experimentation with dating other races. It’s just ‘in them’ to be with a black woman (a major generalization, obviously they have their own individual preferences within the black female population). We are all individuals, after all. It’s good to open your mind to different possibilities. More reading at my friend’s website: http://www.swirlingandmarriage.com/ As there are plenty of prejudices and misconceptions around the way we each see the other race in the context of relationships.
    Cheers All

  14. First,I’m a CRAPPY DANCER,so I don’t fit that black male stereotype.Others I seem to belie:At 60,I’m a good ol’ black Canadian lad with boyish good looks,a muscular build-I’m 5’9″,200 lb.,sporting 18-inch arms-who’s attempting to become a Country music song-writer,and resembles a handsome black cowboy stud IN AND OUT of my Wranglers jeans and other casual and/or Western garb.Since I also possess a 150-160 IQ-GENIUS LEVEL,FOLKS!!!!!-speak and comprehend the language at a 16.4 Grade Level (first year University Post-Graduate Student),HATE “urban”
    music,i.e.,(C)rap,most of today’s R&B-though I LOVE ME SOME STAX-VOLT
    MEMPHIS SOUL AND OLD-TIME RAUNCHY BLUES!!!!-and don’t attempt to speak like a semi-literate hip-hop thug,I’m said to be a “sell-out,” and “inauthentically
    black.” Plus,rather than fat,fugly,frigid,b***hy “sistas,”I CAN’T RESIST buxom blonde cowgirls and farmers’ daughters between 25 and 40-AND VICE VERSA!!!
    (Of course,bosomy black gals are ALWAYS WELCOME to be my bosom buddies!!!!)
    I guess,therefore,I don’t pass the “street cred test.” BOO-FREAKIN’ HOO!!!!!!

  15. Unfortunately, due to the system of white supremacy (racism) many blacks are confused to the max. Confused about who we are, what are we are supposed to be, who we want to be , who white people are, why white people are racist, why they (whites) don’t treat us right, and so on and so forth. So I can understand why this sista is confused about feeling guilty about leaving black men for the same men who engage in, support, and condone the mistreatment of black people. While general principle is that people can date who they want, is it in good judgement to be dating, marrying, procreating with the same people who engage in, condone, and support our mistreatment? NO!!!!! Most white people whether they are male or female, mean or “nice”, have black “friends”, spouses, lovers, half-black children/non-white children do or say absolutely nothing to eliminate the system of white supremacy (racism).
    If black females and males would just stop fussing, fighting, backstabbing, betraying, hatin on each other and examine why many of us treat each other this way (starting with studying the system of white supremacy(racism)..what it is and how it works), get back to our roots by engaging in-depth study of our history and culture, then take the necessary knowledge and techniques to bring our relationships (romantic and non-romantic) and communities back together then we won’t have time worrying about feeling guilty (or thinking about) dating, marrying, procreating with our HISTORICAL ENEMIES. Bottomline!!!!

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